Next as Next Action list
In "Next" view when we click "show projects" it should show ONLY
the very first action on each active project's list.
As a rule of thumb projects mainly consist of linked actions which
means you can't progress to step 2 without completing step 1
example:
call Bob
send e-mail to X about Bob's opinion
there is absolutly no value in showing in "Next" both "call bob" and "send e-mail..." because I can't do anything about e-mail until I have called Bob.
GTD's power comes from not being reminded about task we can't do
anything about ...yet
current "Next" is cluttered because of this
my suggestion:
either go for pure GTD and show only tasks and projects first item on it's list
or
give us an option that will define how many projects steps do we want to see in "next" view
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32 Posted by Terminado on 18 Apr, 2010 01:54 AM
I am completely okay with manual ordering of tasks.
I want to be able to mark more than one task in a project as a Next task (or Today task) so I can do what I can, given time, context, etc., or if I'm working on multiple tasks in a project contemporaneously.
If we also have the option to configure certain projects with sequential Next Actions, that would be good but I don't consider it essential or even important..
33 Posted by Proximo on 19 Apr, 2010 07:23 PM
@roddyt,
I actually am with you on this. I do see the benefit of choosing how many task in a project show in the Next List because we all have different needs.
I do not have a problem with manually moving my task within my project to make this happen. I am constantly doing mini reviews and I always do my weekly reviews, so I know what's going on and see no problem with a manual process.
I also agree that automation can be something that get's out of hand and the purpose of GTD is to keep it simple.
34 Posted by Marco Canepa on 11 Oct, 2010 12:49 AM
Hi ya' all. I know this discussion is 6 months old, but the issue doesn't seem to have been addressed yet in Nirvana.
I'm new to this app and so far I'm loving it, but the issue of a "next" list cluttered with unactionable stuff has been bugging me too (along with the lack of ticklers).
I've been reading this discussion but feel like the solutions suggested are rather unintuitive. As a graphic designer I like to keep things as intuitive and simple as possible. So, here's an idea for coping with both parallel and sequential tasks in projects in an easy way:
NESTING them!
Right now you drag tasks into projects, right? Well, all you'd need to do to set them as sequential or parallel tasks, would be dragging them into the project's ROOT to set them as parallel, or dragging them INTO ANOTHER TASK, to make them a sequential step after that particular task.
This way, parallel tasks would show in the same level of the project tab, much like they do today, while sequential tasks would be right under their parent tasks, only slightly to the right.
Here is a mockup I made:
NIRVANA NESTED
Easy, right? ...all ROOT tasks would display in the NEXT list, while the nested ones wouldn't. When a PARENT task is marked as completed, the nested tasks would move to the ROOT, therefore becoming active tasks in the NEXT list.
Of course you could have as many levels as needed, and have parallel and sequential tasks in each level.
Who's with me?!
35 Posted by Marco Canepa on 11 Oct, 2010 12:56 AM
Hmmm... the link to my mockup was broken and a second comment with a clickable thumbnail seems to have been filtered by the spam filter, so here's the direct link:
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b122/cuentafuna/Mockups/nirvana_n...
Hope this time it works.
36 Posted by Zach on 11 Oct, 2010 01:46 PM
I gotta give this a +1. I wonder if things might get overly complicated,
but I think Marco's solution is pretty elegant.
On Sun, Oct 10, 2010 at 8:58 PM, Marco Canepa <
***@tenderapp.com<tender%***@tenderapp.com>
> wrote:
37 Posted by Proximo on 11 Oct, 2010 08:53 PM
@Marco,
A new major update is coming soon that should address this. I would wait until then to see if the new features address the issues mentioned.
38 Posted by Kelley on 20 Oct, 2010 09:54 PM
I love Marco's suggestion, and think it would be an excellent feature to add. I am looking forward to the new update Proximo referred to.
39 Posted by greg.golightly on 12 Jan, 2011 06:52 PM
This is one of two things I really really want Nirvana to do and I will love and promote it even more than I do. :)
I would like this OPTION in the 'next' global view and I would like it in a project view as well (to just see the single next action).
Oh, and the other thing I really want to see is nested projects. That topic causes a lot of debate among GTD users and I understand that . . . so I get that not all folks want it. But my first thing is a GTD universal truth. At least to me. ;)
40 Posted by Proximo on 13 Jan, 2011 03:37 PM
I am still standing by to see what takes place.
I personally choose to work my Projects in a sequential manner, even when there may be a parallel task within the project.
It keeps things simple and focused for me. My project move forward and I spend my time and energy on getting it done and not managing the project.
I think having sub-task or sub-projects is great, but it needs to be done in a simple way.
I don't care much for the idea of making all the task at the top level parallel while the indented task are sequential because it adds too much complexity to the process. I think it would be much easier to have a star and another simple icon such as a Plus sign.
When you click on the star the task appear in the Focus list as it does today. When you click on the plus sign, it marks that task as a Next Action and it shows in the Next list.
I still don't have my "Unified Next List" that many of us were waiting for in Nirvana 2 and this bothers me. I am trying to be patient, but the most important update the veterans were expecting with N2, was the "Unified Next List" which I personally think is the best description of what a true Next List should be doing.
I will continue to wait and see if the following things happen:
41 Posted by Marco Canepa on 15 Jan, 2011 07:13 AM
I see your point, Proximo, but I guess different people feel comfortable with different types of workflow.
In my case, I like to see everything that needs being done and is actionable at any particular time in a project, so I can choose the path of less resistance (I choose either the simplest thing, the fastest -or hardest, if I'm full of energy- to do, the one that fits the moment or context, or tasks that are similar). I understand that "contexts", "energy" and "time" tags cover that, but the tag system has never felt very intuitive or useful to me.
What I like about the indented or nested system, is that it is automatic. Once you accomplish certain tasks, the next ones show, or the root of that particular project is marked as done, then the next step is immediately displayed as the next action. Also, anyone familiar with drag-and-dropping in a windows folder environment should feel at home managing the nested system.
The problem I see with the "plus" system you suggest, is that I need to constantly re-check the tasks in every single project to see what needs to be marked as the next thing to do once I accomplish the ones in the next list, which can get very time consuming, although it does help to remind you of everything else that needs being done.
Anyway, this is just theory, we would need to try it to see what really works best.
I totally agree about The Unified Next list, though.
42 Posted by Proximo on 17 Jan, 2011 02:53 PM
@Marco
Great point.
Let me share an observation I made recently.
I currently use the "Sequential next action" view for my Next List. I would use the "Unified list" but it's broken at the moment.
The top most task of a Project is the Next Action by definition and this task is the only one that shows on the Next list. Once you complete it, the next task becomes the projects NA and is now listed on top and on the Next list.
This is exactly how I feel it should work and the only thing that would make it better is to have the "Unified list" mode working. The unified list would work exactly like the sequential next action list, but will not have a separator at the bottom. It would be a unified list that shows all next actions, single and projects.
Here is what I noticed lately.
I really don't need parallel task support.
I always mention on these discussions that I am really big on simplicity. I think simplicity is more productive. I noticed that I move my projects forward at a very good pace when I only have one thing to consider. When a project only has one next action, I spend less time on it's structure and more time on moving it forward.
Focusing only on the next action of each project has allowed me to simply get things done without much though and the projects move toward completion at a steady pace.
So the less time I am spending trying to figure out which task are sequential, parallel, next actions, etc. The more productive I have become.
I have several projects that contain both sequential and parallel task. When I work through these projects with only one next action in mind, I move them forward without any wasted energy on trying to manage the project.
I created the sequential list one time and treat any parallel task as sequential as well. This makes it very clear for me to decide what I work on because I am only looking at the next action of each project. it's been very productive for me and I no longer feel the need to manage the parallel task.
At this point, I almost don't care if the parallel task support is ever implemented because I don't think I would use it anymore. I don't think I would sit there and try to figure out the task dependencies based on sequential vs. parallel. The simplicity of only having to look at one possible next action for each project has made a huge difference in my productivity.
David Allen recently posted something about how people over manage their GTD and I agree with him.
I am still learning and growing with GTD but it feels so good when I see something that is simply working and the reason behind it is the lack of complexity involved.
Just wanted to share this observation I made because the automation of having the next action moved up for me is working out great.
Here is David Allen's post. http://goo.gl/3GY11
43 Posted by Lasares on 18 Jan, 2011 05:45 PM
I would love to see an implementation of Marco's suggestion for sequential (or dependent) tasks as nested tasks. It is really neet in terms of usability.
In the mean time, it would be nice to have an option to show more than one project task in the sequential drilldown view (maybe up to 3 ?).
Anyway, we cannot complain. The present implementation is a big improvement over version 1, which was already impressive.
44 Posted by ashcreighton on 09 Feb, 2011 05:45 PM
I'm trying to figure this out, and maybe I'm an idiot, but what constitutes which items go into the "next" category?
I'm using NV2, and I thought the "Sequential Drilldown" would include each of my projects' next items of action (the top first item in each project). Some are there, but others are not. I can go to the project itself, and clearly see an item on top that should be next, but it does not appear in the "Project Actions: Sequential Drilldown."
(I'm in "Show All Areas of Focus".)
Tried a lot of different things myself and tried to find an answer here and I'm stumped. If I'm missing something obvious, forgive me :)
45 Posted by ashcreighton on 09 Feb, 2011 05:48 PM
...oh... is that what you mean when you say the "Unified List" is broken?
46 Posted by Proximo on 09 Feb, 2011 06:51 PM
@ashcreighton
The "sequential next actions" mode has a bug that prevents it from showing all projects. This bug has been around from the start and it's still not fixed.
The "unified list" mode is broken and does not accomplish what a unified next list should be.
Not to dive too deep into history here, but the Unified Next List is something we have been asking since Jesus was in 3rd grade.
The Next list should show ALL Next Actions on one list to include single next actions and only the Projects Next Actions. The projects Next Action would be the top most task. This will allow the list to only show what you can actually take action on while allowing you to sort the Next Actions in the order of importance.
This means I should be able to drag a Projects Next Action along with single Next Actions in perfect harmony.
Currently the "sequential next actions' and "unified list" modes fall short of how a true Unified Next List should work.
47 Posted by ashcreighton on 17 Feb, 2011 04:56 PM
@Proximo
Thanks a lot for the explanation - thought maybe I was doing it wrong :)
Looks like a final resolution of the Unified Next List is on the way - can't wait :)
48 Posted by Lasse on 18 Feb, 2011 11:16 AM
I'm really looking forward to the UNL. Here's a wish for its implementation:
I've worked with my "fake UNL" (using Later as a workaround) for a while and like it. But sometimes it's nice to change views and see all my next actions sorted by the respective projects. So what I'd like to see is this:
- Keep the (fixed) Sequential feature. - Add "drag project task to Next" feature (which would make it possible to manually define next actions for those projects which aren't purely sequential). - Enable switching between "Unified View" and "Project View". The latter would need to show me only my Next actions, not all my project tasks and my single action tasks (which by DA's definition is not a Next Actions list). So basically what I want is to have a true Next Actions list with the option to display it in two different views (unified and divided by projects). Then I'd be a huge step closer to GTD heaven! :)
49 Posted by Proximo on 18 Feb, 2011 04:27 PM
@Lasse
I agree 100%